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Re: We're All In This Together?

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:16 pm 
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Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
It really is class warfare.
If I live in Newcastle does it cost less to send my kid to university?
Does Sky have a special rate for Leeds?
Do stamps cost less in Sunderland?
What is the road tax discount for Doncaster?



I've nicked that for another board.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:19 pm 
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Feel free to extemporise on a theme.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:22 pm 
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Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
Feel free to extemporise on a theme.


I'm looking forward to cheaper foie gras in Fazakerly.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:25 pm 
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The TV Licence is £48 in Gateshead.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:26 pm 
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Sainsbury's in Barrow-in-Furness announce they will now haggle over vegetable prices.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:27 pm 
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In Hampshire they pay more for electricity.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:27 pm 
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Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
It really is class warfare.


It's only class war when the proles get a bit bolshy.

What I can't understand is the Tory line that this will apparently encourage government bodies to relocate jobs to poorer regions - when we've been told consistently for the last two years that overdependence on public sector jobs was the problem with struggling regional economies in the first place. These scorched earth tactics are repulsive, yet Tory supporters still wonder why they're so despised in the north.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:29 pm 
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Yup.

VAT is 12% in Hetton-le-Hole and Chopwell.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:43 pm 
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Quote:
"The bulk of the measures in the budget are going to be targeted at working people on low and middle incomes. That is our priority," he told Marr.

"What we want to do is make sure this country earns its way in the world. We have secured this country's economic stability with our plan to reduce the debt and deficit, which I think has been completely vindicated by events over the last year on the European continent."


I cannot express my anger right now.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 5:26 pm 
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There's a decent article on regional pay here:

http://opinion.publicfinance.co.uk/2012 ... ten-myths/

Quote:
George Osborne’s promise of greater regional pay differentiation for public sector employees is based on some common myths about the way national and local pay levels are determined

Day by day the number of myths or misunderstandings about local pay determination in the private and public sectors seems to grow. In part this is because some of the economic theory behind many of the assertions is ignorant of actual practice and thus the development of rational arguments is made more difficult.

Myth number one was asserted in the Chancellor’s 2011 Autumn Statement which said: ‘While private sector pay is set in accordance with local labour markets, public sector pay is usually set on a national basis.’ Here is a classic example of not comparing like with like. The fact is that most large, multi-site private sector companies have national pay structures. These organisations, among them retailers, banks or telecom companies are not dissimilar to large, multi-site public sector organisations that have national pay structures.

...

Myth number three is that there is significant regional pay variation outside of London and the South East. In reality there is much less than is imagined. There is much more similarity than difference. In practice, most of the retailers and banks that operate with zonal-type pay systems have national pay structures outside the South East that have worked well for them for some time, without seeking to differentiate between Newport, Newcastle or Nottingham.

Myth number four is that local labour market/cost-of-living factors have displaced skill level, qualification and job weight in setting pay in the private sector. Even in smaller private sector organisations, skills and qualifications will be key factors. And there is plenty of evidence that international engineering companies with bases in Gloucestershire and Derbyshire will use international salary data on skills and qualifications rather than local data for recruitment purposes.

...

Myth number six is that public sector pay is set by rigid national agreements, with no scope for flexible interpretation. Yet in many aspects of pay modernisation in the public sector in recent years local pay flexibility around national pay spines has been a key feature. Most large public sector bodies have inner London, outer London and South East allowances and in some cases they have London regional pay bands.

...

Myth number eight is that there is something intrinsically better about not having any national structures in place. But leading HR professionals in large companies with branches throughout the country would say national pay structures and national pay determination provide simplicity, avoid the costs of duplication, allow better pay bill control, create consistency and avoid poaching and leapfrogging.

...

Myth number ten is that the public sector should start varying pay without regard to any other factors, but change does not occur in a vacuum. Employers in the public sector have spent much of the past ten years trying to develop pay systems that would eradicate equal pay challenges. Paying people doing ‘like work’ at different rates of pay ‘for no good reason’ would re-open the gates to equal pay challenges and any number of challenges about unfair treatment. Even zonal pay systems can provoke arguments about unfairness over where the lines are drawn.


The real purpose behind this is twofold - a) to reduce private sector pay in poorer regions (theoretically making them more attractive for employers, but in reality leaving people with less money to spend - rendering them unable to serve their purpose as good little consumers) and b) to make it more attractive for private firms to come in and snap up yet more government functions.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:18 pm 
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It's simply, in no way, a reasonable idea and seems entirley aimed at fucking over the public sector. It may have no difference at the level of unskilled labour, but will have a huge impact in skilled labour causing either a "brain drain" to the south, or a massive amount of private sector involvement in public services.

E.g. Jonh Anybloke is 37 and from Newcastle. He has been in IT for some time. He's faced with a choice:

1. Be an IT consultant for the council at £36k
2. Work for a private IT consultancy firm at £45k, and then be hired out to the council at £50k.

What does he do? Answers on a postcard...


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:42 pm 
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Quote:
"The bulk of the measures in the budget are going to be targeted at working people on low and middle incomes. That is our priority," he told Marr.

"What we want to do is make sure this country earns its way in the world. We have secured this country's economic stability with our plan to reduce the debt and deficit, which I think has been completely vindicated by events over the last year on the European continent."


Of course, that also means less money overall in poorer areas making them poorer still. Keynes must be turning in his grave....

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:59 pm 
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This is all like stumbling around in a dream sometimes. I can't quite bring myself to believe that the Tories are acting like such Tories. I think I kid myself that somehow the world has moved on a bit but... I dunno. If you had sat down before the last election and drawn up a worst case scenario the reality would surpass that. We're in that weird zone between plausability and spoof.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:22 pm 
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It's almost as if they want to Balkanise the entire country. Despite Cameron's misty-eyed proclamations of unionism, more or less everything this government does appears to be vindictively targeted at those areas that won't bow down and vote Tory. Taking money (and therefore purchasing power) out of weak regional economies at a time of prolonged slump merely makes things worse - even blinkered ideologues like Osborne must surely be able to see that, which makes me think there's a deliberate policy of managed decline going on here.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:26 pm 
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There is something disturbing about the way ideology is blinding them to the obvious finanical consequences of their actions.

Look at the way they ignore all comparisons with the enviable US growth rate and ours. They're intent on one path and to hell with the evidence or the arguments.


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