I noticed in the GE 2015 thread that one or two think it is possible UKIP might be boosted by defections from the BNP.

I just wanted to point out, in case you didn't know... that we don't want them and we say so on the membership page. It is one condition of membership particularly highlighted. Of course just like any other party there is a full list of t&c's which are available separately.

Membership is not available to anyone who is or has previously been a member of the British National Party, National Front, British Freedom Party, British People's Party, English Defence League, Britain First or the UK First Party. Any applications made from people who are or have been members of these organisations will be refused, and any subscriptions collected will be refunded.
By applying for membership you certify that you are not and have never been a member of either of these parties.

http://www.ukip.org/helpukip

You might point out that it would be difficult to prevent ex-BNP or other undesirables joining and I suppose to a certain extent that's true. They would have to keep it under their hat if they didn't want to be reported and ejected. More likely, if they wanted to carry on being BNP and part of a more successful organisation then they would join something like the EDL or whatever.

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Most of our so-called reasoning consists in finding arguments for going on believing as we already do.
"Emmett is able to write fairly well, he clearly isn't unintelligent overall" - Quote MALCO - Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:57 pm

AFAIK the EDL takes care not to market themselves as a political organisation, so it would have to be the Pepsi Party.

How easy is it to filter them out though? Surely for every thicko street-brawler there's two who take care not to make their allegiance obvious, for reasons such as this. How proactive do you hope to be in checking these people out? Facebook friends with unsavoury posts? Drunken slur down the pub after a meeting? What about people who are racists but who have no affiliation with the BNP/NF or whatever? There are plenty in all walks of life, and many of those are probably attracted to parties such as yours (no personal offence intended) because they see UKIP as a spiritual home for the more upstanding, respectable jingoist.

Do you know how many members (or ex-members, rather) have been evicted and had their subscriptions refunded so far? It's stretching credibility to claim there is no-one in UKIP with past far-right affiliations. I'd imagine, although this is pure speculation, that financial backers who previously funded the BNP or EDL or whoever, may see your own party as worthy of more attention now you're in the big leagues. I'm genuinely interested to know whether or not this has any substance and to see where it ends up. You've already posted news that UKIP are ahead of the LibDems in the polls. Would it be cynical to assume this move is an attempt to reassure potential voters that they would not be choosing a party that endorses racists and fascists? Because this will face scrutiny from people much better equipped to answer that than myself.

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"Common Sense is the collection of prejudices aquired by age eighteen" - Albert Einstein

All very well Emmett, but the obvious question is why so many would wish to join you. If people are making a decision between the BFP (who are neo-Nazis) and you, do you not find that somewhat worrying?

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On top of that, just because it's on their site and they claim it, it doesn't mean they'll stick by it.

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Changin' avatars like there's no tomorrow

Emmett, fair play. Keep your eyes open though.

I can assure you we do. The problem, as I mentioned is that you can't get the political history on every new member to verify. So the defence is either expecting them to be honest and not join knowing we don't want them... or making it clear that we don't want them and reserving the right to reject them if they are discovered.

This particular condition of membership has been highlighted on our website for a few years already and has always been important to us. The whole purpose though is not that we feel those kinds of people find our party particularly attractive but that the media, the establishment and party-politically motivated detractors have spent a lot of time and energy attempting to promote UKIP as being similar to the BNP. We just want to make it clear that we reject them as much as everybody else does! So it is primarily a response to our critics rather than an acknowledgement that they find us attractive. Additionally of course we really mean it... we don't want them!

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Most of our so-called reasoning consists in finding arguments for going on believing as we already do.
"Emmett is able to write fairly well, he clearly isn't unintelligent overall" - Quote MALCO - Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:57 pm

Thank you...

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Most of our so-called reasoning consists in finding arguments for going on believing as we already do.
"Emmett is able to write fairly well, he clearly isn't unintelligent overall" - Quote MALCO - Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:57 pm

Of course UKIP don't want BNP members in their ranks. They insist on wearing jeans and reading the Sun in the clubhouse, when we all know it should be strictly corduroy and the Telegraph.

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"Even when you're a super-computer with an IQ of 2000 it's brown trousers time."

Reclaiming "methinks" for the nation

Latest blog post - 2011 - a review (updated 07/10)

Indeed!

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Most of our so-called reasoning consists in finding arguments for going on believing as we already do.
"Emmett is able to write fairly well, he clearly isn't unintelligent overall" - Quote MALCO - Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:57 pm

Good bit of thinking, putting that clause in.
The violent far right has always looked to turn more legitimate organisations so it can hide its true face.

Labour party could learn a trick and insist that no body (LibDems) who's represented the coalition comes sobbing to them prior to election time.
Rank and filers might be OK.

I'm rambling....

Tactically it would be electoral poison to have BNPers joining any constitutional party.
For UKIP there's also the problem that some of the BNP have pan-european ambitions, which doesn't sit well with the program.
There's a lot more to political program than a simple "Are you further right than Toby Young?"

Having a written clause has the advantage that if/when entryists are discovered, it's a simple matter to terminate their membership.
No shilly-shallying about with creating policy on the hoof, or the BNPers getting a day in court to argue their angle.

Writing it down also shows some commitment.
It's less likely to be "Something somebody said at the Brighton conference" (Bit of a Yarwood moment there - Do you have conferences in Brighton?).
Because it's written down, it's there for future accountability.

Can't think why anyone from the far right would want to join UKIP.

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"Even when you're a super-computer with an IQ of 2000 it's brown trousers time."

Reclaiming "methinks" for the nation

Latest blog post - 2011 - a review (updated 07/10)

I can understand not wanting to have BNP thug-types in the party doing their own thing in the name of UKIP, but why would you not accept those who genuinely want to become UKIP members? No doubt before the last election, a few right wing people joined the BNP as a result of their "We're not racist, we're just British" bollocks, and now realise that the party is rather racist. If they wanted to join UKIP, as a party that acknowledges their concerns around immigration and EU sovereignty, but doesn't have the overtly racist tones, you'd deny them?

Precisely what I was thinking. No other political party (as far as I know) explicitly disbars former members of other political parties from joining it, in fact I have heard of former BNP members (and former Tories and former Lib Dems) who are now committed Labour Party members and recognise how naive they were ever to have been taken in by racist argument, so it's slightly puzzzling why UKIP uniquely should feel the need explicitly to disbar these sorts of people in the way that it apparently does.

Unless you consider that, for some reason, UKIP may be particularly attractive to entryist members and pragmatically racist former members of far-right racist parties.
What indeed, could that reason be?

Perhaps, Emmett, you should re-write your rule to include the word "un-reconstructed"?

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