The Mail & the Police

Paul · **Posted:** Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:33 am

The Mail readership, being usually out of touch with reality, looks back to an era when the likes of Dixon of Dock Green policed the streets.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dixon_of_Dock_Green

Obviously a fictional character but he normally got his man with no more than "your nicked"

Use this thread to highlight stories in the Mail that seem anti Police or where the readers use it as an opportunity to whinge about the Police in general.

Examples.

Now police are told they can use Taser guns on children

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... rtComments

Quote:

Now we descend into anarchy. The law is far too soft on criminals of all ages in the first plcae, and the free use of Tasers in such a way will only prove to be at best chaotic, and at worst the death of a child - possibly even an innocent child.

This is simply a wrong move in a direction which was wrong a long time ago.

- Rn, Coventry, UK

Pedestrian hit by police car suffers broken foot - and £80 penalty for 'denting' vehicle

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... rtComments

Quote:

The police say that you are wrong. Therefore you are wrong. Although there may or may not have been a crime in progress requiring the police, the fact that the police were called merits that you COULD have been doing something illegal.
You were wrong because the police say you were wrong. Just be glad they did not beat you further for "trying to carry away the marked car" which may be viewed by a civilian as trying to get the car off of your foot. Either way, you were wrong becasue they said you were wrong and you are going to be in more hot water because of your refusal to pay the fine of which you are guilty, because they simply say you are.

Enjoy the nanny state. Live the nightmare U.K.

- Steve, Rutherford

Adam · **Posted:** Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:52 am

Quote:

The police say that you are wrong. Therefore you are wrong. Although there may or may not have been a crime in progress requiring the police, the fact that the police were called merits that you COULD have been doing something illegal.
You were wrong because the police say you were wrong. Just be glad they did not beat you further for "trying to carry away the marked car" which may be viewed by a civilian as trying to get the car off of your foot. Either way, you were wrong becasue they said you were wrong and you are going to be in more hot water because of your refusal to pay the fine of which you are guilty, because they simply say you are.

Enjoy the nanny state. Live the nightmare U.K.

- Steve, Rutherford

Labours the point a bit, doesn't he?

Paul · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2007 9:00 am

Another gem.

Fines please! Police get on-the-spot ticket machines

Quote:

Police are to get ticketing machines to issue on-the-spot fines to shoplifters and vandals.

But there are fears that the devices, which will lead to even more of the controversial £80 fixed-penalty notices being handed out, will reduce the status of officers to that of traffic wardens.

Quote:

Norman Brennan, a serving police officer and director of the Victims of Crime Trust, said officers were being reduced to the equivalent of "traffic wardens", handing out tickets.

So one mans quote becomes the major concern

larrylargesse · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:01 am

http://comment.independent.co.uk/column ... e91723.ece

Paul · **Posted:** Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:29 pm

Another one.

Police offered cash prizes for not taking time off sick

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

Paul · **Posted:** Thu Sep 06, 2007 4:51 pm

next up, I was waiting for this one.

Every driver's dream... using a Taser on the 'Mad Mullah of the Traffic Police Taliban'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

cycloon · **Joined:** Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:07 pm **Posts:** 3244

'Amnesty International says the weapons, which temporarily disable a suspect, have been linked to more than 150 deaths in America.'

I thought organisations like Amnesty simply wanted to help terrorists kill everyone?

Majestic · **Posted:** Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm

What is wrong with being anti police or the public speaking out ?

Just like you are speaking out agains their ideologys.

Does this thread not cause the same problem that you are accusing the public and the DM are doing ?

Its not okay for them to highlight it, but its okay for you to highlight them ?

Seems very detrimental to me.

Oh and btw the 'wages' topic, what other company you know gets paid an incentive just for turning up to work ?!
Possibly because so many of them have so much time off sick, its got beyond a joke now.
I see Mr Cooper states the illness in the force has dropped dramatically because of this new incentive in his area (Manchester) because of the incentive.
Maybe then JUST MAYBE, they was not as ill as they made out in the 1st place and surely that should be more looked into why they are willing to take days off, rather than give them something for doing what they should be doing, working. !

This is coming from a guy 'I am presuming' that lives in Cantium in Kent, not exactly crime ridden down there is it.

cycloon · **Joined:** Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:07 pm **Posts:** 3244

There's being 'anti police' and then criticising the police, the former of which is silly and the latter is of course valid. The Mail and its commentators seem to want the best of both worlds, a police force that does everything it can (as it should and is reasonable to expect) while at the same time slagging it off when it does anything that 'targets' motorists, etc.

There's also stupid ideas and initiatives, and different ways of dealing with them. Most people here dislike the way the Mail frames things, not that they inherently disagree or agree with EVERYTHING the Mail takes offence at. Offence which is riddled with double standards and hypocrisy.

Majestic · **Posted:** Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:44 pm

cycloon wrote:

There's being 'anti police' and then criticising the police, the former of which is silly and the latter is of course valid. The Mail and its commentators seem to want the best of both worlds, a police force that does everything it can (as it should and is reasonable to expect) while at the same time slagging it off when it does anything that 'targets' motorists, etc.

There's also stupid ideas and initiatives, and different ways of dealing with them. Most people here dislike the way the Mail frames things, not that they inherently disagree or agree with EVERYTHING the Mail takes offence at. Offence which is riddled with double standards and hypocrisy.

That is my point exactly.

They have their own opinion on the police, just you and I do, and like it or not, its only their opinion on certain matters.

I have read so many times that people state the 'speeding' issue with police is because of the 'middle class' :roll:

Nothing to do with it at all, as everyone at some point or another would have sped on the motorway to get somewhere if late.
The speeding issue as we know full well is not to keep drivers safe but to make them more money and catch them out in circumstantial areas of the road.

Now, again he is quoting people about the police in his 1st comment and how wrong it is for them to criticize, but this topic starter is doing the same thing, if not worse, as they are only commenting on a message board that has the topic and agrees with the newspaper.
He is actually going out of his way to find 'snippets' of news from the newspaper to highlight in hisopinion what is wrong.

Who is right or wrong ? or are all right/wrong in their own way ?!

Samanfur · **Posted:** Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:59 pm

Paul wrote:

next up, I was waiting for this one.

Every driver's dream... using a Taser on the 'Mad Mullah of the Traffic Police Taliban'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

As someone living in Brunstrom's catchment area, I have to admit that he got a fraction of respect from that for me.

At least - unlike in the case of his daughter's conveniently swept under the carpet speeding fines - this was him stepping up and being willing to take what he wants to dish out to everyone else.

It doesn't stop me thinking that he's got a self-confessed "obsession" with speeding and that trying to blame the press for anything he gets caught for is cheap and nasty (sorry - I was researching a feature on him a few months back, during the decapitated biker debacle), but at least it's something.

Run · **Posted:** Fri Sep 07, 2007 4:03 am

Majestic wrote:

They have their own opinion on the police, just you and I do, and like it or not, its only their opinion on certain matters.

[.....]

Now, again he is quoting people about the police in his 1st comment and how wrong it is for them to criticize, but this topic starter is doing the same thing, if not worse, as they are only commenting on a message board that has the topic and agrees with the newspaper.
He is actually going out of his way to find 'snippets' of news from the newspaper to highlight in his opinion what is wrong.

But it's not just an opinion - look again at the comments quoted in the first post. It's hyperbole. "Now we descend into anarchy"? Yeah, Britain is on the edge of a completely dissolved government. "You were wrong because the police say you were wrong"? Yeah, it's not like we have a whole system of arbitration courts and internal affairs officers that keeps the Police from fucking up and making wrongful arrests (and compensating victims when they do). "Nightmare UK"? No, not hyperbole in the least.

We're mocking the hyperbole, not their 'opinion'.

Quote:

I have read so many times that people state the 'speeding' issue with police is because of the 'middle class' :roll:

Nothing to do with it at all, as everyone at some point or another would have sped on the motorway to get somewhere if late.
The speeding issue as we know full well is not to keep drivers safe but to make them more money and catch them out in circumstantial areas of the road.

Some will disagree with this, but I suggest we keep discussion to the speeding thread, otherwise we're in for a major derail here

Paul · **Posted:** Fri Sep 07, 2007 10:17 am

I started the tread.

It is only right that the Police are held to account for their failings & and there is a proper process for this.

This thread is to highlight to constant sniping at the Police in the Mail with often very thin "stories" used to highlight "failure".

If you read the readers comments that pass the "Dacre Filter" they are often ludicrous in the extreme.

Oh! by the way Majestic welcome on board. You will find that you have a greater freedom of expression on here than the half truths of the Mail comments pages.

As this thread develops, just see the the contrived nonsence they come up with.

bairy · **Joined:** Tue May 08, 2007 1:40 pm **Posts:** 2807

As we all know, the Mail's answer to crime is to lock up everyone for everything (except motorists or tax dodgers)

I came across this little snippet from wiki

Quote:

Rehabilitation

There is a popular assumption that sending people to prison reduces their offending. This has not yet been proven. Studies of the impact of imprisonment on later offending have found that offending actually slightly increases after a term in prison compared to after some other, non-residential sanction. This meta-analysis of one hundred separate studies found that offending was around 7% higher after imprisonment than after a non-residential sanction, and this finding was statistically significant. Another meta-analysis of 101 separate tests of the impact of prison on crime found a 3% increase in offending after imprisonment. Longer periods of time in prison do not make the outcomes any better; to the contrary, offending increases by around 3% as prison sentences increase in length.

What is effective in reducing offending is effective rehabilitation programmes.

Click the link above the quote to read more.

Run · **Posted:** Sun Sep 09, 2007 7:42 am

Along with the tautological last sentence and the mis-spelled title, that whole paragraph is really sloppy. I'm willing to bet there are no references for its claims (i'd check but I'm having trouble reaching wikipedia here)

I've heard good things about rehab too but I'm not prepared to accept that paragraph as fact just yet.

The Mail & the Police

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