Discussion of the UK Government
:sunglasses: 50 % :grinning: 50 %
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By bluebellnutter
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#499227
It also falls apart given that McGuinness did actually serve prison time for his various activities, so I doubt a further such stint would have phased him enough to motivate what would become a 30 year acting piece.
 
By Bones McCoy
Membership Days Posts
#499228
PaulOnBooks wrote:Did Tebbit ever comment on the South African Truth and Reconciliation Commission? By his logic, the fuzzywuzzies should instead have been machine gunning thousands of heroic white farmers surely?
As I recall he was in favour of maintaining "civilised rule" in South Africa and Rhodesia.

He was also part of a posse who wrote batshit pieces in the "Dear Bill" era Telegraph.
Stuff along the lines of "It's time to release Rudolph Hess, enough time has passed".
 
By MisterMuncher
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#499240
It's a boldly uncompromising and stridently anti-terror response from a man who day in a government negotiating constantly with the IRA via back channels whilst blind-eyeing UDR barracks becoming de facto UVF bases.

Please do not construe the following as a statement of sympathy with the IRA.

It says much of Tebbit's level of introspection that the violence perpetrated by the IRA renders all involved with it as innately corrupt and basically unforgivable, yet he is incapable of seeing that McGuinness would have adequate reason, given his time and place, to form the same opinion re: The Government, loyalists etc. These were people actively trying to kill him and his people, even prior to his IRA membership. That he recently managed to wipe even one foot clean is something to be lauded. There's plenty of unforgivable to go round here.
 
By Kreuzberger
Membership Days Posts
#499241
Also and for the avoidance of doubt. At the time, I would not have shed a tear had an ounce or two of HMG's lead found its way into the back of Martin McGuinness' cranium.

However, the peace dividend is more robust than many could have imagined - certainly me - yet Tebbitt will never accept that. "We 'ad 'em on the ropes and should have finished the job", is his schtick today with every outlet that will give him airtime.

Whether he is right or not is immaterial. We are where we are, and that is, by and large, a Good Place. Tebbitt's relentless undermining of the progress, whether he likes or means it or not, does nothing less than to call the settlement itself into question.

What is needed now, as May seems indifferent to fragmentation and the possibility of a hard Irish border, is not greater division. Yes, I know he and his wife have suffered immeasurably but it is high-time a tory put the country before himself. Just for once.

EDIT: Wee one for clarity.
Last edited by Kreuzberger on Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
By youngian
Membership Days Posts
#499246
If it wasn't Tebbit it would have been Katy Hopkins or some similar gobshite just to provide a contrarian point of view. R4 PM went for Nigel Havers whose dad was once nearly blown up by the IRA. This man is on Eddie Mair's speed dial and seek his opinion nearly every week on an issue of the day. Why I have no idea perhaps its a private running gag.
By Silkyman
Membership Days Posts
#499249
mr angry manchester wrote:I am bitter about, and will hate Thatcher, until the day I die. The difference is McGuinness did some bad stuff in the early part of his career, but then changed tack and became a man of peace later, as did Ian Paisley, and for this, he should be given some credit.

Tebbit is a horrible man who pursued the politics of confrontation.
They both deserve some credit for the change of tack, but that doesn't mean a man who saw his wife crippled for life isn't entitled to be a little bit miffed at a figurehead of the organisation who did it.
 
By bluebellnutter
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#499250
I should point out that I fully understand why Tebbit is bitter, however I think being vitriolic on the day when people have lost a close relative is, I think, poorly judged. Especially in light of the many others who, unlike Tebbit, actually saw their relatives killed, who were prepared to acknowledge his role in the Peace process.
By mr angry manchester
Membership Days Posts
#499258
If it had been left to people like Tebbit, the peace process would never have happened and the bombings and bloodshed would have continued. I cant condone what McGuinness was involved in in the early part of his career, but I recognise, and give him credit for his huge contribution to peace in Northern Ireland, in the later part of his life.
 
By youngian
Membership Days Posts
#499262
One of Tony Benn's wiser observations was that anyone called a terrorist by the British government will end up having dinner with the Queen. I remember thinking at the time that's a fair point but that's not going to happen with Adams and McGuinness. Warlords become statesmen and the Queen had been there and bought the T-shirt by the time she was making pleasantries with McGuinness.
By Andy McDandy
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#499273
In the words of Tywin Lannister*, "You can only make peace with your enemies".

Tebbit lost friends to the IRA and saw his wife maimed. Likely he saw the IRA as little more than a criminal gang - a well armed gang for sure - that would in time be busted by a rigorous police investigation. There may be some truth in that. But he also has to acknowledge that if you wanted lasting peace in NI, you had to bring everyone to the negotiating table and that included Sinn Fein and the PIRA, who did represent people, and who recognised that the SDLP and the Stickies were about as useless as a chocolate teapot in getting any sort of progress for the Catholic population.

*Game of Thrones reference. In fact over the weekend I met a guy who works for the NI tourist board showing people round the sets and filming locations. He was rather proud that that's what NI means to a lot of people worldwide these days.
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