Topics about the Labour Party
:sunglasses: 87.1 % :grinning: 6.5 % 😟 3.2 % :cry: 3.2 %
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#550104
Steven Bush wrote:And while there are undoubtedly people who hold anti-Semitic views within the Labour party, their strength comes not from people who agree with them, but who regard it as something that has to be ignored in order to prioritise retaining control of the institutional levers of power within the Labour Party. And that’s why Willsman is the true face of Labour’s anti-Semitism crisis.
https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/s ... e-momentum
By visage
Membership Days Posts
#550107
Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:34 pm
Winegums wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:13 am
How does Corbyn bat this away
Well, in the words of the old joke, if that's where you want to be you shouldn't start from here. The Livingstone business poisoned the well, and then the modification of the IHRA definitions put the lid on it.

Firstly, act against the anti-semites. Quickly, not two years later. Hang an admiral or two, pour encourager les autres.

Then accept the IHRA definitions. No caveats or the usual mumbling about wrongs on both sides.

Apologise, fulsomely, often and deeply. Break bread and eat salt with a rabbi or two at Shabbat dinner. Grovel.

Then change a bit, get rid of the dogma, listen to the party.

That might work.
I cant imagine Corbyn doing any of those things, let alone all of them.
#550142
visage wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 1:39 pm
Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:34 pm
Winegums wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:13 am
How does Corbyn bat this away
Well, in the words of the old joke, if that's where you want to be you shouldn't start from here. The Livingstone business poisoned the well, and then the modification of the IHRA definitions put the lid on it.

Firstly, act against the anti-semites. Quickly, not two years later. Hang an admiral or two, pour encourager les autres.

Then accept the IHRA definitions. No caveats or the usual mumbling about wrongs on both sides.

Apologise, fulsomely, often and deeply. Break bread and eat salt with a rabbi or two at Shabbat dinner. Grovel.

Then change a bit, get rid of the dogma, listen to the party.

That might work.
I cant imagine Corbyn doing any of those things, let alone all of them.
I'm no longer a party member, and am one who decided to give Corbyn a chance.
But on this issue alone he has to go.

The right thing to do here here is so fucking obvious that David Blunkett could see it, blindfolded and without his dog.

Stop mincing words, adopt the necessary regulations, kick some fuckers out.
In a world in awe for strong leaders it would send a message that stretched beyond the anti-semitism debate.

Instead we have Corbyn dithering (again) and providing an example to many voters why he isn't P.M. material.

Labour's enemies are getting free hits every newsflash - and it could so easily have been avoided.
I like to think it would never have been an issue in the party I joined.
#550150
The new Willsman transcript that Sky have got hold of should seal it for Corbyn. Pissing about texting people before a speech at the Somme, asking which bits of a whitewashed report he has to give a shit about.

Either Willsman has done for him by mouthing off a load of bollocks, or it’s accurate and Corbyn really doesn’t give a shit and is stupid enough to admit that to someone who gets themselves recorded mouthing off.

Regardless, I reckon he’s fucked.
#550153
A few people on Facebook saying that the real scandal is that an NEC meeting was secretly recorded.

Shit like that also helps people give up on mainstream politics. Obsession with procedure over the bigger picture.
#550158
crabcakes_windermere wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:52 pm
Either Willsman has done for him by mouthing off a load of bollocks, or it’s accurate and Corbyn really doesn’t give a shit and is stupid enough to admit that to someone who gets themselves recorded mouthing off.

Regardless, I reckon he’s fucked.
In saner times, of course he would be fucked but this is just another depressing circus that will leave town at the end of the week and Corbyn will carry on regardless.
#550164
Malcolm Armsteen wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:34 pm
Winegums wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:13 am
How does Corbyn bat this away
Well, in the words of the old joke, if that's where you want to be you shouldn't start from here. The Livingstone business poisoned the well, and then the modification of the IHRA definitions put the lid on it.

Firstly, act against the anti-semites. Quickly, not two years later. Hang an admiral or two, pour encourager les autres.

Then accept the IHRA definitions. No caveats or the usual mumbling about wrongs on both sides.

Apologise, fulsomely, often and deeply. Break bread and eat salt with a rabbi or two at Shabbat dinner. Grovel.

Then change a bit, get rid of the dogma, listen to the party.

That might work.
Okay so he expels overt anti-semites.

We are adopting the IHRA definitions, but not the examples which are shit. But sure, now we adopt the examples. NOW the board of deputies cite all these examples of speech which previously hadn't been illegal, but by virtue of being anti-Zionist is now anti-Semitic. Does Corbyn have to cut ties with everyone he knows who is critical of Israel? Do we expel everyone from the party who has pointed out the problems with Israeli policy vis-a-vis Palestine?

Corbyn did eat dinner with Jewdas, which resulted in them being called "not properly Jewish" by the totally sincere right wing of the press machine.

He's always listened to the party fam, it's what winds up the dead weight in the PLP so much.
#550176
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:44 pm
NOW the board of deputies cite all these examples of speech which previously hadn't been illegal
Hang on, what's been made illegal?
As in behaviour which now falls foul of the IHRA definitions with examples.
#550177
Winegums wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:31 pm
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:44 pm
NOW the board of deputies cite all these examples of speech which previously hadn't been illegal
Hang on, what's been made illegal?
As in behaviour which now falls foul of the IHRA definitions with examples.
Illegal, you say?
#550178
Hugo Rifkind today recalled going on the Iraq march and being surprised by all the Palestine banners from the SWP. Israel's responsibility for invading Iraq wasn't too obvious. Because it's always about Israel. And if it's sometimes about Al Qaeda or ISIL or Assadists, it's not as intensely about them as it is about Israel. This will have come across to many Jews very clearly for years. Those banner wavers are Corbyn's SWP allies. This baggage was always going to be a problem.
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