Topics about the Labour Party
:sunglasses: 77.3 % ❤ 2.3 % :grinning: 11.4 % 🧥 2.3 % 😟 2.3 % :cry: 2.3 % :shit: 2.3 %
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#567913
This is such a wierd argument. Yes, a lot of the press are right-wing owned and it would be marvellous if they focused on the racism of many Tories more.

But I don’t want them to focus on the issues in Labour less as a consequence. Corbyn has a problem with how seriously he takes this as an issue. He wants to be PM and he wants decent people to vote for him on a platform of being a better person than May and leading a party that is dedicated to being fair and standing up to abusers. But he needs to *be* that better person, and take the action needed without trying to do stuff like let his chums off lightly, not just be found wanting less often because the media are looking elsewhere.

I don’t want a party that gets away with it more. I want one that deals with the problem so there isn’t anything to get away with.

As someone said on Twitter in reply to Owen ‘bootlicker’ Jones’ regurgitation of the party approved line that antisemites in Labour are a very small proportion, it’s hard to judge how small when a whole room of Momentum members applaud Chris Williamson when he says Labour has been too apologetic.

When a whole room gives him the silent treatment, or even boos him, then maybe that’ll show things are getting somewhere.
#567914
lord_kobel wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:29 pm
Winegums wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:29 pm
They campaign as a mainstream political group and the idea that they can get away with being racist is bollocks.
Yet you want that to apply to the Labour party, just because the tories are a bit shitter.
No
#567917
Abernathy wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:54 pm
Boiler wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:29 pm
Now suspended.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47393626
I detect that Tom, Emily, and Keir are finally flexing their muscles. If we could just get shot of fucking Seumas.
Preferably with a catapult.
#567922
If they had taken a zero tolerance approach to it, it wouldn’t be news, to counter the often spoke mantra of the far left “let’s focus our efforts on tories”

Williamson has spent the last year promoting deselections in between that his other interest seems to be the Jewish race.

At what point will either of those topics lead to Labour winning an election?

No doubt the response to Williamson caused some to leave, I wrote my letter of departure that afternoon. It was the enabling of Brexit that was the red line, this was disgusting though.

Any Labour leader of the last 80 years and that includes Foot would have this government fucked. It just so happens our membership chose an absolute fuckwit as leader, to not only go soft on a forgettable waste of oxygen that is Chris Williamson but allow it to dominate Brexit.

They are so bad at it all.
#567928
It strikes me that on this issue, just like with Brexit, there is no desire for Labour to lead but to try and come across as being a bit less shit at it than the Tories.
#568005
crabcakes_windermere wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:08 pm
This is such a wierd argument. Yes, a lot of the press are right-wing owned and it would be marvellous if they focused on the racism of many Tories more.

But I don’t want them to focus on the issues in Labour less as a consequence. Corbyn has a problem with how seriously he takes this as an issue. He wants to be PM and he wants decent people to vote for him on a platform of being a better person than May and leading a party that is dedicated to being fair and standing up to abusers. But he needs to *be* that better person, and take the action needed without trying to do stuff like let his chums off lightly, not just be found wanting less often because the media are looking elsewhere.

I don’t want a party that gets away with it more. I want one that deals with the problem so there isn’t anything to get away with.

As someone said on Twitter in reply to Owen ‘bootlicker’ Jones’ regurgitation of the party approved line that antisemites in Labour are a very small proportion, it’s hard to judge how small when a whole room of Momentum members applaud Chris Williamson when he says Labour has been too apologetic.

When a whole room gives him the silent treatment, or even boos him, then maybe that’ll show things are getting somewhere.
There's been clear publication of how small a problem this is. It's well established in multiple ways as being a minority issue. Of course we should strive to do better, but it's absurd for the media to blow this out of proportion. Chris Williamson chose his words poorly, but I think he was getting at the idea that the constant apologising feeds into a narrative that we're doing wrong.

For reference, there was a recent Jacobin article on anti-semitism in light of the attacks on Ilhan Omar. Point 6 is particularly pertinent here
Don’t expect the issue to go away.
There’s no way to avoid confronting this issue head-on. Left-wing movements will not be allowed to move on to other things: a concession, an apology, a gesture of repentance will never be enough, it’ll just be taken as an admission of guilt before the next round of attacks begin. In Britain, this controversy has been turned on and off repeatedly, to coincide with moments when it can inflict maximum damage.

Earlier this month, Labour’s general secretary Jennie Formby presented detailed evidence of the steps she had taken to root out antisemitism in Labour, but the immediate response of anti-Corbyn Labour MPs was to accuse her of lying, without a shred of evidence. They simply won’t take “yes” for an answer.

The new right-wing splinter-group formed by ex-Labour politicians like Chuku Umunna and Angela Smith has claimed to be taking a brave stand against antisemitism — presumably because support for Trump’s would-be coup in Venezuela, the Saudi invasion of Yemen, and private ownership of Britain’s water supply doesn’t make for a very attractive platform.

“Progressive Except for Palestine” (PEP) is a contradiction in terms. You can’t have a democratic foreign policy that makes an exception for Palestinian rights, and you can’t have a socialist movement worthy of the name without a democratic foreign policy.

Countries like Britain and the US have ravaged the world with their aggressive wars and support for authoritarian regimes. The Labour and Democratic Parties have been fully complicit in that shameful history. Pushing back against the foreign-policy establishment in London or Washington will be hard, thankless work, and those who engage in it should expect to be vilified.

But there’s no alternative — unless we want to find ourselves in the company of those who fawn over ghoulish war criminals like Elliott Abrams and roll out the red carpet for MBS.

Ilhan Omar won deserved praise for her readiness to challenge Abrams as he prepares to inflict more carnage on the peoples of Latin America. The foreign-policy consensus in our countries is both stifling and extremely brittle. It requires the absence of politicians who are willing to call a spade a spade.

That’s why the leaderships of the Republican and Democratic Parties were so quick to go after Omar — they want to make an example of the first non-conformist, in case her example proves infectious.

Any movement that wants to bring about radical change in both domestic and foreign policy will need to back up its representatives when they take a brave stand, and push them to be bolder still. You don’t always get to pick your battles, and this is one that socialists can’t afford to shirk.
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