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Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:06 pm
by Watchman
I've never actually seen one...how common are they?

and I'm sure its never, ever crossed the mind of a tabloid editor that they could be a great way of getting an "in the public interest" photo of a private event!

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:12 pm
by Safe_Timber_Man
They're becoming more and more common in the UK. I've seen about 4 or 5 in the last couple of months and flew one just a couple of weeks ago.

The footage you can get from them is beautiful, to be honest. Really smooth sweeping aerial shots in high quality. It's like something you see in films, only now you don't need a helicopter!

I can see them becoming a bit problematic, though, in some cases. Although, the reasons they could be problematic most likely aren't the same reasons Mailites want to smash up any that they see flying overhead and demanding they are banned.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 5:32 pm
by Andy McDandy
Of public interest, rather than in the public interest, I think...

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 11:20 pm
by Harold Shand
Yes, you're supposed to have CAA permission, plus training/qualifications to use them. Certainly if you're using the larger versions for filming with large digital super 35 cameras. Plus huge public liability insurance.

We do however use smaller ones such as the DJI Phantom and Inspires for sneaky shots, but always in a controlled environment such as a race circuit.

What will happen soon, and will be to the Mail's glee, will be students and low budget productions coming a cropper and injuring someone.

The Mailites seem to take a very dim view of them, as if they will all soon be victims of an aerial armada outside their bathroom windows. I've had people with their kind of mentality say things like 'Oooh, you don't want that to get in the wrong hands'. When questioned why, you can guess the answer.

When you mention remote control aircraft, they like them.

Typical sensationalist bollocks, spoon fed to them. I wonder how many of them sit down to a drama with aerial shots and wonder how they were achieved.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 7:20 pm
by Malcolm Armsteen
I saw a prog the other day - it may have been Coast - and the drone shots were absolutely wonderful. Actually added to the story by going from distant to close, and moving in 3D, showing the landcape in a way that no other filming method could. Exciting.

If I was a Mailie I'd be more worried about cyclists' helmet cams or motorists' dashboard cams.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 8:03 pm
by lectrospin
Safe_Timber_Man wrote:I did wonder that. It's bollocks, isn't it?
"oh shit, i hope i didn't hit that airliner that just flew over my property, i thought it was illegal."

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 8:12 pm
by Malcolm Armsteen
Hit an airliner with a net or an airgun?

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 8:14 am
by MisterMuncher
Malcolm Armsteen wrote:I saw a prog the other day - it may have been Coast - and the drone shots were absolutely wonderful. Actually added to the story by going from distant to close, and moving in 3D, showing the landcape in a way that no other filming method could. Exciting.

If I was a Mailie I'd be more worried about cyclists' helmet cams or motorists' dashboard cams.

Indeed. Because the otherwise law abiding have plenty to worry about in that sphere.

The thing gets me about these tales, and the Double-Decker Bus Sadfacing of a few weeks ago, is the unspoken thread of narcissism in it all. They've simply taken it as axiomatic that anyone wants to see them or film them above anything else. The very notion that no-one gives a tinker's dam for anything about them just doesn't enter into it. I'm reasonably sure I've seen suburban aspirational fuckwits in their habitat once. I can't imagine repetition will improve the experience.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:12 am
by Malcolm Armsteen
Had a conversation on Facebook last night with a rather soppy ex-pupil who objected to people taking photographs in the street that may include her. Which given the ubiquity of phone cameras must now happen pretty frequently. Her friends were telling her that in Britain we have a 'Privacy Law' that says no-one can photograph anyone else and that she has a legal right to take their phone/camera and delete any pictures to which she objects.

Screaming 'Meeeeee!!!!'

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:15 am
by Fozzy
I hope you put them right, Malc? Otherwise your ex pupil and her friends are going to start clogging up the justice system in a big way.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:25 am
by Malcolm Armsteen
Did my best. Trouble is they believe the last piece of crap they heard...

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:38 am
by youngian
Can someone give me an update as to what the law is on photographing you without permission. I have a feeling I should know but domestic and ECHR case law has developed somewhat in the last few years.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:25 am
by Harold Shand
Malcolm, Coast used to filmed by Castle Air with their Augusta helicopter. It's a got a stonking great long lens (Canon HJ40 I think) in a side mounted pod and what is effectively a small gallery in the passenger compartment. The range of the lens is colossal, which may make it look like a drone shot (and could well be).

Ian, if you're in a public place then you are technically 'fair game', certainly for news or documentary shots. Commercial use (such as advertisements) is a bit different and i'm not sure what the legal standing is, but I would think you have to go down the release form route. That would apply to both video and photography.

The public place scenario is what the paps thrive on.

If I'm doing some pretty video shots of say Waterloo Bridge and there's commuters on it, then as long as it's a loose shot of 4-5 people then I'm ok. If I was to follow someone without their permission then I'm in trouble.

No-one has the right, including the Police to delete images or footage. They are evidence.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:30 am
by Malcolm Armsteen
That's my understanding.
We have an 'issue' arising at the moment, where if I photograph our candidate speaking to a member of the public and then wish to use that image in publicity materials, the party won't print it unless we have some form of release, which is fair. Of course it means she is usually pictured talking to people she already knows.

It may not have been 'Coast' but something similar. It was a long, swooping shot across grassland and then down over a cliff and onto the beach. It was stunning.

Re: The Mail and modern technology

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:44 am
by Harold Shand
Yep, as you say you'd need some form of release form or permission.

I think though, if they were to be used on a website, you'd be fine. Especially if it was a 'looser' shot and included a couple of people listening.

I have resorted to carrying the Met Police's and ACPO's guidelines with me when filming/snapping, it's frightening how many people 'know' the law and won't believe you. Mail does me no favours.

Drones are exciting bits of kit, opens up that world where previously I'd need a rather large helicopter budget. Have a look on Vimeo for Philip Bloom - Koh Yao Noi. Just watched it this morning, made for nothing in terms of kit.