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By Tubby Isaacs
Membership Days Posts
#321638
What an arse he's become. Says tell me one good thing about Islam.

Asian lady replies that it preached equality in the context of India's caste system.

He tweets.

"One woman even had the cheek to say Islam fosters human equality. Maybe she was being sarcastic, I certainly hope so."

And bigs up Douglas Murray for exposing something, when it was Sky News.
 
By youngian
Membership Days Posts
#321640
He seems to have diverted from his scientific remit to push a basic schoolchild debate along the lines of why are there wars if there is a god.

But I've generally enjoyed his TV work such as his recent faith school documentaries in which he confronts 'science teachers' indulging creationist mumbo jumbo in British schools. One was from a state sponsored Muslim school who told Dawkins that she explained evolution inher class but she and the pupils all agreed that it was not true. Fuck cultural sensibilities in this case, she should be out on her arse.
 
By Abernathy
Membership Days Membership Days Posts
#321671
Tubby Isaacs wrote:What an arse he's become. Says tell me one good thing about Islam.

Asian lady replies that it preached equality in the context of India's caste system.

He tweets.

"One woman even had the cheek to say Islam fosters human equality. Maybe she was being sarcastic, I certainly hope so."

And bigs up Douglas Murray for exposing something, when it was Sky News.
A little context would be nice for these condemnations.
 
By Tubby Isaacs
Membership Days Posts
#321723
Abernathy wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:What an arse he's become. Says tell me one good thing about Islam.

Asian lady replies that it preached equality in the context of India's caste system.

He tweets.

"One woman even had the cheek to say Islam fosters human equality. Maybe she was being sarcastic, I certainly hope so."

And bigs up Douglas Murray for exposing something, when it was Sky News.
A little context would be nice for these condemnations.
Douglas Murray in the Spectator mentioned some shitbag who's been allowed in to Britain, wrongly. But it was Sky News who spotted it. Murray wanted Pamela Gelller allowed in but she wasn't.

Dawkins said "Murray exposed the double standards"- as if that's what Murray cares about.
 
By Tubby Isaacs
Membership Days Posts
#321725
youngian wrote:He seems to have diverted from his scientific remit to push a basic schoolchild debate along the lines of why are there wars if there is a god.

But I've generally enjoyed his TV work such as his recent faith school documentaries in which he confronts 'science teachers' indulging creationist mumbo jumbo in British schools. One was from a state sponsored Muslim school who told Dawkins that she explained evolution inher class but she and the pupils all agreed that it was not true. Fuck cultural sensibilities in this case, she should be out on her arse.

Yes, I saw that and he was of course right.

But I think there's a leap from that happening in state schools with our money to open season on Muslims, which is where he now is. I mean "tell me one good thing about Islam" FFS. Has he met any Muslims? Are the good bits about them all secularist and the bad bits Muslim? Surely you have to take them in the round and give them credit for being good people, and allow that part of that at least might have something to do with Islam.
Last edited by Tubby Isaacs on Sun Jun 30, 2013 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
By Altfish
Membership Days
#321735
Tubby Isaacs wrote:What an arse he's become. Says tell me one good thing about Islam.

Asian lady replies that it preached equality in the context of India's caste system.

He tweets.

"One woman even had the cheek to say Islam fosters human equality. Maybe she was being sarcastic, I certainly hope so."

And bigs up Douglas Murray for exposing something, when it was Sky News.
Well, considering the way Islam treats women (i.e. second class citizens) when someone claims that "Islam fosters human equality" surely it is reasonable to think she is joking?
 
By Abernathy
Membership Days Membership Days Posts
#321740
Indeed. I'd say Dawkins has a fair point. Given that the literal meaning of Islam is (apparently) "Total submission to god" you can see why that would not exactly be to the taste of somebody like Dawkins (or for that matter somebody like me).

The usual caveats about religion's benefits of social cohesion and continuity etc aside, broadly speaking I'd share that slightly jaundiced view of the Islamic religion in particular, but certainly of other religions too.
By Andy McDandy
Membership Days Membership Days Posts
#321742
Altfish wrote:
Tubby Isaacs wrote:What an arse he's become. Says tell me one good thing about Islam.

Asian lady replies that it preached equality in the context of India's caste system.

He tweets.

"One woman even had the cheek to say Islam fosters human equality. Maybe she was being sarcastic, I certainly hope so."

And bigs up Douglas Murray for exposing something, when it was Sky News.
Well, considering the way Islam treats women (i.e. second class citizens) when someone claims that "Islam fosters human equality" surely it is reasonable to think she is joking?
In comparison to the deal women could expect under Hinduism, Islam was a step up.

Admittedly, that's like saying the Mail is better than the Express, it's degrees of shit we're talking about, and neither is comparable to what we're used to in modern Britain, but it was a significant difference.
 
By Tubby Isaacs
Membership Days Posts
#321826
Yeah, that's the sort of thing that I was getting at.

Dawkins talks as though Islam's like Scientology- invented in the 20th century, amid a relatively liberal order. When you exist under colonialism, Hindu nationalism etc, it's a bit different. Given that the woman he later ridiculed had mentioned Hindu castes, I think he's being extremely tabloid.

Which isn't to say there aren't loads of utter shitbag Muslims oppressing other Muslims.

As I say, I'd rather people under the cosh read Marx.
 
By Abernathy
Membership Days Membership Days Posts
#321839
Dawkins is still right to mock the claim that Islam fosters human equality, though, as clearly it does nothing of the kind. However much the type of Islamic scholar that typically appears on TV on a Sunday morning with Nicky Campbell might point to the 26th hadith or whatever that enshrines absolute gender equality, practically and culturally it is very clear that populations where Islam is the dominant faith institutionally sublimate the female gender to the male in quite radical and oppressive ways.
 
By Tubby Isaacs
Membership Days Posts
#321843
Dawkins is still right to mock the claim that Islam fosters human equality, though, as clearly it does nothing of the kind
Well sure, but the lady mentioned it in the context of the Indian caste system. To have that then chucked back at her with no mention of context, well, that's barely A level stuff. Probably that comes with the territory in Twitter, see Diane Abbott, but he's bright enough to understand the problems of the medium.

He was very alert to the fact that his work on selfish genes was apt to be hijacked by the hard right. He now seems to see people like Douglas Murray as allies. I think that's a shame.
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