Discussion of other UK political parties
:sunglasses: 48.5 % ❤ 3 % :thumbsup: 7.6 % :grinning: 28.8 % 🧥 4.5 % 🙏 1.5 % 😟 3 % :shit: 3 %
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#574763
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/13/heidi-allen-challenges-nigel-farage-to-live-tv-debate-before-eu-elections-brexit-party

Heidi Allen challenges Farage to an EU debate. This didn't go very well when Clegg did it. People like Farage just lie if in doubt.
#574764
Tubby Isaacs wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 5:04 pm
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/13/heidi-allen-challenges-nigel-farage-to-live-tv-debate-before-eu-elections-brexit-party

Heidi Allen challenges Farage to an EU debate. This didn't go very well when Clegg did it. People like Farage just lie if in doubt.
Yeah, not a great idea. Farage will of course accept, as he no doubt takes the Trumpian view that there is no such thing as bad publicity. He'll do his usual blowhard stuff and all the BP fan boys and girls will trot off to post their ballot papers for the Nigel party.
#574783
If they really are determined that this debate should go ahead - and I agree that it isn't a good idea in the slightest - then surely Soubry would be the best one to pitch against him?
#574810
Debate isn't a medium for facts or resolution, it's about making plausible *sounding* arguments that appeal to the audience. As such, it's an absolute fucking waste of time trying to counter fuzzy half truths regarding things "everyone knows", delivered for maximum emotional punch with actual hard evidence, facts or logic.

Malc is right about the pigeons.
spoonman, Samanfur liked this
#574811
What genuine people mean when they say they want a debate: they want a mutually-agreeable inquiry into the nature of a problem/disagreement
What university debate clubs mean when they want a debate: to win with rhetoric and to irritate everyone in the surrounding 10 square miles
What twats mean when they want a debate: they want to shout their bullshit and get cheered and the other party/ies are completely irrelevant except as being the (identified a priori) enemy.
#574813
MisterMuncher wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 10:51 pm
Debate isn't a medium for facts or resolution, it's about making plausible *sounding* arguments that appeal to the audience. As such, it's an absolute fucking waste of time trying to counter fuzzy half truths regarding things "everyone knows", delivered for maximum emotional punch with actual hard evidence, facts or logic.

Malc is right about the pigeons.
Makes me groan every time people say "oh we'll just debate the fascists and beat them in the marketplace of ideas". Never works, never will. Punch the fash, no platform the fash, ignore the fash.
#574814


absolutely fucking dreadful. the "doing your homework at the start of class before you hand it in" of political parties.
#574872
Winegums wrote:
Tue May 14, 2019 12:27 am
MisterMuncher wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 10:51 pm
Debate isn't a medium for facts or resolution, it's about making plausible *sounding* arguments that appeal to the audience. As such, it's an absolute fucking waste of time trying to counter fuzzy half truths regarding things "everyone knows", delivered for maximum emotional punch with actual hard evidence, facts or logic.

Malc is right about the pigeons.
Makes me groan every time people say "oh we'll just debate the fascists and beat them in the marketplace of ideas". Never works, never will. Punch the fash, no platform the fash, ignore the fash.
Well, yes and no. A well intentioned opponent who takes the high road won't win out. One prepared to dig right in to the actual nastiness and provoke them into showing their true colours would wound them amongst their shy support.
#574880
Every time we televise these debates we normalise 'bith sides'. See also the flat earther Vs scientist bullshit. Some debates, some problems, some ideas just can't be solved this way.
#574935
I genuinely don't think it's a big deal. She's hardly the gargantuan intellect who would bring him down.
#574936
Thing with live debates is, you never know for certain how it will go. I don’t think debating Farage is a good idea because even if he throws a hissy fit it’ll be cut and re-edited by his lackeys to look good. But he’s all his party has got in the sense of people who can come over as relatively normal. Debating one of the other candidates could pay off because they’re far more likely to either lose their rag and/or say something batshit crazy.

I mean, I’d love Farage to slip up on live TV and say something dreadful, but it’s just unlikely to happen.
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