[Tubby Isaacs]

There's no filter these days, is there? Even with all the focus on Luciana Berger, nobody gets hold of the situation and says "Can't we ease X into the background a bit?"

[Winegums]

For fuck's sake, get the split done, let these desperate to show loyalty constituency parties put up every socialist worker headbanger they can find and let these bigoted imbeciles find out themselves that they're about as electable as a massive pile of dogshit with fairy lights on spelling out the word "CUNTS". Corbyn isn't going to win jack shit so we're going to get the Tories again anyway, so get it over with now.

On this point, we agree. I am pants-wettingly excited for the liberal technocrats or whatever the fuck they call themselves to get off the ground.

JK FUCKING ROWLING.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Liberal and technocrat. Sounds good to me.

[Winegums]

Just a shame centrism.biz is already taken.

[MisterMuncher]

Heavens no. Not technocrats. Might as well be experts.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Yeah, better to put people who join political parties in charge of decisions.

[bluebellnutter]

"What do we want?"
"People who hate people who understand how shit works!"
"What do we want them doing?"
"Running stuff the people they hate understand but they don't!"

[Winegums]

Peak. Centrism.

"Things are basically fine, we just need experts in charge. Thank god there's no such thing as ideology anymore now we're past the end of history."

Cannot wait for this new party to emerge and immediately have zero impact.

[crabcakes_windermere]

As opposed to what, Winegums?

Seriously, you think people are going to vote Labour now? You have a leader no one trusts who lets bullies and bigots off the hook, surrounded mostly by also rans and incompetents, who is helping push through the pet project of Nigel Farage. Leavers won’t vote for him. Remainers definitely won’t vote for him. Tories won’t vote for him.

Last election there was everything to lose and people voted to avoid Tory Brexit - which he squandered. Next election - assuming we have some form of Brexit - it’s all already lost.

[cycloon]

Peak. Centrism.

"Things are basically fine, we just need experts in charge. Thank god there's no such thing as ideology anymore now we're past the end of history."

Cannot wait for this new party to emerge and immediately have zero impact.

You're a parody of yourself. You despise the very thing you are: barren ideology and barren lack of ideology are the same bloody thing at the end of the day.

[visage]

Plus the danger of a new party isnt that they sweep into power - its that they'll hive off enough Labour votes that even given the challenges Crabcakes has outlined they may well end up losing even more seats to Tories.

At this point the cry will go up about loyalty...

[youngian]

Peak. Centrism.

"Things are basically fine, we just need experts in charge.

Experts aren't in charge politicians are. That's why they are called technocrats and not politicians. A bit like 'unelected bureaucrats' What other bureaucrats are there? If you're elected you're not a bureaucrat you're a politician.

Thank god there's no such thing as ideology anymore now we're past the end of history.

Take That were fresh face teenagers the last time I heard 'the end of history' theory quoted. Even Fukuyama doesn't quote his famous line anymore.

[cycloon]

Yeahbut liberalism isn't an ideology it's clearly not interested in ideas and the abstract at all its entirely uh... not what I like so... uh...

[Andy McDandy]

Besides, read up on the ideology propelling the right. End of cold war, piece dividend (AKA we put up with crap from the soft left to defeat the Soviets and claim the world, now where's our fucking piece?), Russians look west and think "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em", etc.

[Abernathy]

Far left groupings have long made common cause with the Palestinian rights movement and opposed the Israeli state and its policies of oppression against the Palestinian people. There have been instances of the unfortunate conflation of anti-zionism and anti-semitism, but also no shortage of instances of actual anti-semitism.

Historically the Labour Party, until around the mid 1980s, was broadly speaking pro-Israel, but from then until, say, 2015, similar instances occurred actually within the party, though not in significant volumes.

Can it be a mere coincidence that the number of incidences of manifestations of anti-semitism within the Labour Party increased exponentially with the entry into the party, prompted by the ascent to the leadership of Jeremy Corbyn, of thousands of former tankies, SWP types, the WRP, Socialist Organiser devotees, and former communists?